[DRAFT, uncorrected text]
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Now, let us go to the next item of the Business, that is, the School of Planning and Architecture Bill, 2014.
THE SCHOOL OF PLANNING AND ARCHITECTURE BILL, 2014
THE MINISTER OF HUMAN RESOURCE DEVELOPMENT (SHRIMATI SMRITI ZUBIN IRANI): Sir, I beg to move:
That the Bill to establish and declare Schools of Planning and Architecture as Institutions of National Importance in order to promote education and research in architectural studies including planning of human settlements, as passed by Lok Sabha, be taken into consideration.
Sir, it is said that planning is to bring the future into the present so that you can do something about it now, but this Bill seeks to address certain challenges that are past, as presented before our students.
SHRIMATI SMRITI ZUBIN IRANI (CONTD.): I am sure that the esteemed Members of the House are aware that the Schools of Planning and Architecture were established in Bhopal and Vijayawada in 2008. However, they did not have the power to grant degrees. The first School of Planning and Architecture was established in Delhi in 1959 and because it was conferred the Deemed-To-Be-University in 1979 ...(Interruptions)...
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: No, no. Let her finish....(Interruptions)...
SHRIMATI SMRITI ZUBIN IRANI:...that institution does not have the challenge... (Interruptions)...
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Please move the Bill....(Interruptions)...
SHRI ANAND SHARMA: Just one minute, Sir....(Interruptions)...
SHRIMATI SMRITI ZUBIN IRANI: Anand ji, I am finishing....(Interruptions)...
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Let her move the Bill.
SHRIMATI SMRITI ZUBIN IRANI: Sir, through you, I will implore to the Members of this august House कि लोकतंत्र के मंदिर से विद्या और सरस्वती का आशीर्वाद आप छात्रों को दे, आज यही निवेदन सब के समक्ष मैं प्रस्तुत करती हूं।
The question was proposed.
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Now, Shri Shantaram Naik.... (Interruptions)... No, no. Please.
SHRI ANAND SHARMA: Sir, I have to say something before we take it up. This morning, this issue was raised by many of my colleagues. It is with regard to the agenda, and, particularly, the Bill which...
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: No, no. I have taken up this Bill.
SHRI ANAND SHARMA: Sir, just one minute. Members want that the motion for referring the second Bill... (Interruptions)...
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Please talk about that when the second Bill comes up....(Interruptions)...
श्रीनरेशअग्रवाल: अभी नहीं हो सकता है... अभी नहीं हो सकता है।
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: The point is that you can raise that when the second Bill comes up.
SHRI SITARAM YECHURY: We request you to change the order.
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: No, no....(Interruptions)...
श्रीनरेशअग्रवाल; कै से कर लगे? यह संभव नहीं है।...(व्यवधान) …यह संभव नहीं है।
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Yechury ji,...(Interruptions)... No, no. Please. There is no dispute regarding this Bill. The BAC has allotted time. If at all you wish to raise an issue regarding the second Bill, that should be done after finishing this Bill. Now, the Bill is moved. Mr. Shantaram Naik, kindly speak.
SHRI SITARAM YECHURY: Sir, it was only a request that after this Bill is over......(Interruptions)...
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: After this Bill, you can do that.... (Interruptions)...
श्रीनरेशअग्रवाल; ये लोग बैठ तो सही! सब जाने की ज दी म ह।...( व्यवधान)...
श्रीउपसभापित; हां, सब लोग बैठ और उस समय इसे raise कर। Mr. Shantaram Naik, please start.
(THE VICE-CHAIRMAN, DR. SATYANARAYANA JATIYA, in the Chair.)
SHRI SHANTARAM NAIK (GOA): Mr. Vice-Chairman, Sir, at the outset, while appreciating the role of the hon. HRD Minister, I would like to say that in spite of the educational qualification of hers being challenged at various forums from time to time—and, I have been telling this to my friends also—you are performing well and you are a capable Minister. I tell this to everybody, and, I want to place it on record. But I am pained to see you going to an astrologer because you are the custodian of the entire scientific temper, which has been inscribed in the Constitution of India. You have to carry that scientific temper amongst the students, amongst the children and amongst the society. Therefore, you do not have a private life as far as this aspect is concerned, and, therefore, I am a little pained that you visited an astrologer.
Now, in the context of this Bill, what are you going to advise? I would like to know the decision on whether you should buy a plot or you should not buy a plot; whether you should buy a flat or you should not buy a flat, has to be taken by the institution with respect to various aspects that they are entitled to. What are you going to tell them? Will they go to a fortune teller and find out? I am saying this with all seriousness because the message that you have given is not commensurate with the role that you have got under the Constitution and as a Minister. Kindly do some introspection.
उपसभायक्ष (डा. सत्यनारायणजटिया): आप विषय पर आइए। Please come to the subject....(Interruptions)... आप विषय पर आइए।
SHRI SHANTARAM NAIK: Is the ‘Constitution’ not a subject, Sir? You are governing from there and you are sitting there under the Constitution. You are sitting there under the Constitution. If the Constitution is not there, you also have no right to sit there, Sir.
SHRI SHANTARAM NAIK (CONTD.): Now, the question is..(Interruptions)..
उपसभायक्ष (डा. सत्यनारायणजटिया): आप इस तरह से बात न करें।
श्रीशान्तारामनायक: मैं इसी तरह से बात करूंगा, जैसा मैंने सोचा है। आपकोआक्षेप लगता है तो आप रूलिंग दे द ।
उपसभायक्ष (डा. सत्यनारायणजटिया): जो विषय है, आप उस पर चचार् नहीं कर रहे ह ।
श्रीशान्तारामनायक: आप रूरूलिंग दे सकते हैं कि मैंने जो कहा, वह गलत कहा है
उपसभायक्ष (डा. सत्यनारायणजटिया): मैं कह राजा हूं कि आप सब्जेक्ट पर आइए।
श्रीशान्तारामनायक: इसका मतलब है कि म स जेक्ट पर नहीं बोल रहा हूं!
श्रीआनन्दशर्मा: उपसभाध्यक्ष महोदय, सदय जो बोल रहा है, उस पर चेयर यह नहीं कह सकती कि उसको क्या कहना है। माननीय सदय विषय पर ही बोल रहे ह, उस बिल पर ही बोल रहे है इसिलए यह नहीं होना चाहिए। इस सदन की यह परंपरा नहीं है। मेरा आपसे निवदेन है कि आप नयी परंपरा न डालें।
उपसभायक्ष (डा. सत्यनारायणजटिया): मैंने आपकी बात को ध्यान से समज़ा हैं और मैं यह कह रहा हूँ की यह आपका समय हैं और आप जैसें चाहें, वैसे उपयोग कर सकते हैं, लेकिन मैंने यह कहा हैं कि यह तकनीकी विषय हैं, आप उस पर आएंगे तो ज्यादा अच्छा होगा, वह बेहतर होगा! नायक जी, आप अपनी बात शुरू करें।
SHRI SUKHENDU SEKHAR ROY: Sir, I would like to supplement him. What Mr. Shantaram is trying to impress upon is the fundamental duty of every citizen to maintain scientific temper, which is under Article 51A (h) of the Constitution.
उपसभायक्ष (डा. सत्यनारायणजटिया): मेरा कहना यह है की व्यक्तिगत रूप से जो कुछ भी बहार कहा गया होगा, उस पर आपको यह भूमिका बनाकर बात नहीं करनी चाहिए।
SHRI SHANTARAM NAIK: It being the School of Planning and Architecture Bill, 2014, I would like to say I fully support this Bill and various things which are involved in this. Now, since the new concept of smart cities has come in from the new Government, is this school going to play any role as far as construction of smart cities is concerned? Will a study be conducted and inputs be taken from this school for the purpose of establishing smart cities in various parts of the country? If so, what will be the conception? Have you approached this School or any other body in the country so far for the purpose of erecting or constructing smart cities because it is this School which has to guide the nation as far as planning is concerned? Again, I would like to say that this School will be a part of entire education system. Education system of the country is likely to be changed, as you have already stated. You have given an answer to me in this House that the new education policy is going to be evolved. But, at the same time, you have said that no committee has been constituted. All these months have passed, it is such an important aspect of education, and you have not formed any committee. What is the thing which is stopping you? Do you want to go in a particular direction which is not acceptable to the secular country and, therefore, you are going slow so that there should not be criticism? Who are the persons entrusted with preparing the initial draft or guidelines for the purpose of evolving a new education policy? What is the direction that you have given? The country would like to know about this.
Secondly, as and when education policy is evolved..(Interruptions).. Please don’t disturb the Minister.
Since this education policy will cover the entire country and the subject is a State subject, how are you going to, I won’t say impose, convince the State Governments to follow the new policy which you are going to evolve? It will be a very difficult task for you, Madam, because the inputs which will be contained in the new education policy, to my mind, will be dangerous and you will not be able to convince the State Governments to implement that policy.
Secondly, I would like to know which are the legislations that will have to be amended in order to impose that policy in various States. Have you got any plans to take these new schools to prepare standard plans, I would say guideline plans, for the construction of schools, for primary schools, toilets for the schools, community halls etc.? It is because these structures will be required by everybody. Even under MPLADS, we will be requiring it. Are you going to advise the schools to prepare standard plans, which can be used by various other institutions, including MPs for the purpose of implementing in the MPLADS?
Then, the new concept of ‘green houses’ is coming all over the country. People are going in for that. Some people say that ‘green houses’ concept is costly but you have to find out a solution to see that green houses are adopted more and more by people and those houses can be built at moderate rates.
My next point is regarding heritage buildings. I do not know whether existing schools are doing some exercise as far as heritage buildings are concerned but it is very much required that these school authorities, school management and administrative bodies try to see that heritage concept grows in this country. These engineers, who are studying there, can go to places for this purpose. Another aspect is this. As far as whole planning is concerned, the rules governing the construction of houses are very important, and also the rules governing the planning of the cities. Today, these rules differ from State to State. There is no uniformity. In some other States, they also add that National Building Code should be observed in the construction rules. Now, a State is having an Act governing construction, rules governing construction and if they are made to observe National Building Code, I do not know whether they will get a licence. Modiji has said that ‘in my Government, there will be only two layers. No seven or eight layers but two layers’. How is he going to bring two-layer system or three-layer system in the country as far as this construction licence is concerned? We would like to know this because to have minimum steps of layers, as far as building is concerned, is very, very difficult.
Then, again, related to what I said earlier, Madam, since this involves planning schools, what are you going to advise them regarding Vaastu in the context of scientific temper? Are you going to advise them that this aspect of Vaastu should also be observed? It is because I know that some aspects of Vaastu are scientific; where air comes, light comes; that is also there. But, if you carry forward the concept of Vaastu too much, it crosses the limit and it becomes a superstition. People are scared. People demolish their houses after houses are constructed, if a Vaastu expert has told them that this is not good. I was told by one person that there was a quarrel in a family. The Vaastu expert came and that expert said that because your kitchen is in this direction, there is a quarrel in your house. So, these are the things which are to be seen in the context of Vaastu.
Then, Madam, my next point is regarding Clause 32 of this Bill, which provides for a tribunal for arbitration. Earlier, you have withdrawn one Bill regarding tribunals where teachers’ problems are to be solved etc. Maybe, you are introducing another Bill with the improved version. What about this Clause regarding tribunals of arbitration to solve the dispute among the students or management, whatever it is?
I would like to tell you that I made this argument during our regime also. I have got a problem with the Tribunal. Although it says that the decisions given by the Tribunal will be final, no High Court is going to listen to you. They will say that they will exercise their right under Article 226. Nothing can stop them. The Supreme Court will say that it will exercise its right under Article 32. Tribunals only become one additional forum for the purpose of litigation. Article 32 will remain there. Article 226 will also remain there. You have to find out the fate of such tribunals.
Madam, I, therefore, urge upon you to take it up, as and when it becomes a law, in the right spirit for the overall development of the country. Thank you very much, Sir.
DR. C.P. THAKUR (BIHAR): Sir, I rise to support this Bill. This is a very important Bill for the country because three institutions are going to be upgraded to the level of institutions of national importance. The School of Planning and Architecture at New Delhi was given deemed university status, but the other two institutions were not given this status. This Bill is very important and urgent, so that the graduates of other two institutions may get degree. That is one important part of this Bill.
Sir, after upgrading other two institutions, they will also become deemed universities and then all the three institutions will become institutions of national importance. That is the importance of this Bill.
My friend raised some questions relating to planning of smart cities which is a dream project of our Prime Minister. All these things will be taken care of. These institutions will be of very high standard. Their standard can compete with the standard of any institution in any part of the world. I think all the points will be considered in the project of these institutions. As it is a deemed university and an institution of national importance, there will be a Governing Body, a Senate and all the regulations as the NIT, the ITI, etc., have.
So far as planning and architecture are concerned, this is a very important Bill. When a Government slightly matures or achieves something, it goes for architecture because it wants good architecture. When people come to Delhi to see the Parliament, they admire it. Wherever I go, people say that the Parliament is so good. It was planned by some architect. India is growing as a big nation. You have to plan for everything, not just living conditions or buildings. There are many things. In this institution, teaching will be imparted both at the undergraduate level and at the post-graduate level.
The institutions at Bhopal and at Vijayawada will get the power to give degrees. They are not giving degrees to their students. That power will also be provided to them after the passing of the Bill. These three institutions will certainly become assets for the country. The institution at Delhi will cover the north; the institution at Bhopal will cover the centre; and the institution at Vijayawada will cover the south. The excellence of these institutions will be provided to the whole country.
The hon. Minister has done a very good job by bringing this Bill. It was required. Certainly, it will fulfil the dream of our Prime Minister also in designing smart cities and many things for this country. Therefore, I support this Bill.
Sir, before I conclude, I would like to say that even at the time of Pandavas and Kauravas, this aspect of learning was very much in use.
They made a lakshagraha. Nobody could differentiate whether it was a normal house or a house made of wax. In Mughal period and many other periods, there was good architecture. We are also in a maturing state of democracy and we need certain good quality architect and, therefore, I again congratulate the Minister for bringing forward this Bill. It is a very good Bill and it should be supported.
उपसभायक्ष (डा. सत्यनारायणजटिया): धन्यवाद,श्री नरेश अगर्वाल।
श्रीनरेशअगर्वालउत्तरप्रदेश; धन्यवाद सर, आश्चर्यचकित हूँ की इन बिलों को पहले क्यों नहीं लाया गया । इसके पहले आप ट्रिपल आईटी लाई थी, सेंट्रल उनिवेर्सित्य का बिल आया, आज ARCHITECTURE वाला बिल आया है। यह बिल तरक़्क़ी के लियें है । अगर इस बिल के न लाने से वहाँ के छात्रों को इतने सालो डिग्री नहीं मिली, अगर इस बिल के न लेन से उसका ऊँचा नहीं हुआ था, अपने उसकी दी ? आखिर वे लोग पनिश होने चाहियन, जिन्होंने छात्रों के जीवन के साथ खिलवाड़ किया,जिहोने उसको अपग्रेड नहीं वे सुविधाएं नहीं मिलने तीन-तीन, चार-चार सालों छात्र वेट कर रहे की हम को डिग्री मिल जायें । छातर् के जीवन से खिलवाड़ करने वाले जो भी लोग ह,माननीय मंत्रीजी आप उनके ऊपर जरूर ऐक्शन लीजिये। आप क्या ऐक्शन लगी,यिद इसको बता दगी तो समझ लीजिये कि आपको कहीं न कहीं इससे POPULARITY मिलेगी और लोग का वाकई मैं हित होगा। यह ठीक है कि आप इन तीन को अपग्रेड करगी,हमारे देश मैं ARCHITECTURE के और भी इंस्टीटूशन्स है, लकिन अभी हमारी वर्ल्डवाइड स्थिती बहुत अच्छी नहीं है। जब ताजमहल बना होगा,तब ARCHITECT नहीं थे, उनको डिग्री नहीं मिली हुई थी, उन्हों ने 1600 मैं ताज महल बनाया था, वह आज भी हैन। हमारे देश मैं तमाम किले बने हुआन हैं, क्या वे ARCHITECT द्वारा बने हुए हैं? क्या उन्हें डिग्री मिली थी? में जाते हैं तो वहाँ ARCHITECTURE इतना डेवलप हो गया हैकि कु छ कह नहीं सकते। इतना डेवेलोप की कुछ कह नहीं सक्ते। वगैरह छोड़ दीजिये, अप्प डेवलपिंग कन्ट्रीज सिंगापुर, हांगकांग वगैरह मैं चले जाइए, वहाँ पर जो ARCHITECTURE के, उन्हें देखकर तो लगता है के वे हिंदुस्तान मैं हैं हे नहीं । अब डिजाइनिंग के लिए बहार से Architect ला रहे ह। ल रहे है। आखिर क्या कारन हैं? मैंने पिछली बार भी कहा था की हमारा दुर्भाग्य की हिंदुस्तान मैं इतनी भी, इतने कॉलेज होने के बाद भी आज विश्व स्तर के किसी कॉलेज मैं हमारा नाम नहीं हैं, हमारी RECOGNITION नहीं है और बहुत जगह पर तो हमारी डेग्रीओ को मान्यता प्राप्त नहीं हैं । हम इनको अपग्रेड करें, उस स्तर पर खड़ा करें । अभी भाई ठाकुर जी कह रहे थे की प्रधान मंत्री स्मार्ट सिटी बनाएंगे -- 100 स्मार्ट सिटी, उनका ARCHITECT कौन होगा,यह भी तर हो जायें, अत: आप ARCHITECT देखिए ।अब अच्छा ARCHITECT लाना पड़ेगा,तो आप जापान से लाएंगे,अमरीका,लंदन या और कहीं से भी ARCHITECT लाएंगे,आपको हिंदुस्तान का कोई ARCHITECT नहीं मिलेगा। आज,जबकि लड कम हो रही है,तब Architect की ज्यादा जरूरत है लैंड काम हो रहीं है, तब architect की ज्यादा जरूरत हैं, जिससे की काम जमीन पैर,काम जगह पैर अच्छी चीज बने । मई चौंगा की आप इसको खली अपग्रेड करके डीम्ड यूनिवर्सिटी दे दें, इससे यह मतलब नहीं होगा की यह अपने आप मैं एकदम बहुत फाइन हो गया । जब तक वहां योग्यता नहीं दे देते हैं, तब तक खाली दर्जा या डिग्री देने से कुछ नहीं हो सकता है। मैंने आपसे कई बार ओरली भी कहा था कि हो सकता हैं की डीम्ड यूनिवर्सिटी पर किसी मंत्री न कुछ गलतियां की हैं,लकिन उसका यह मतलब नहीं हैं की उसकी सजा हरदम के लियें हो जाएँ। माननीय सर्वोच्च न्यालयय ने एक रोक लगाई,परंतु आज ऐसा क्य हो रहा हैकि सरकार सिर्फ़ न्यायालय के आदेश पर चल रही,वे अपने JURISDICTION है, वे आपने JURISDICTION मैं निर्णय क्यों नहीं ले रहीं हैं? एक प्रथा ऐसे हो गयीं हैं की न्यायललय आदेश दे दे, हम उसका पालन करें, लकिन हम अपने विवेक से निर्णय नहीं लेगें । आज प्राइवेट COLLEGES, जिन्होंने कंप्यूटर एजुकेशन के जरिया मैं इतना एवेलोप कीयां, आप उनको तमाम यूनिवर्सिटीज से एफिलिएट, लकिन यूनिवर्सिटी गाइडलाइन्स हैं, ऊन उनको कितना हरेस किया जाता हैं,आप समज सकतीं हैं । लकिन अब वहीँ एक डीम्ड यूनिवर्सिटी बन जाती हैं, तो उसको कम से कम उन यूनिवर्सिटीज के ऐसे क्राइटेरिया से छुटकारा मिल जाता हैं, जिन्होंने मकड़जाल फैला रक्खा हैं । अगर हमारे वैस्टर्न यूपी मैं कोई कॉलेज खोलेगा तो उसे मेरठ यूनिवर्सिटी से RECOGNITION पड़ेगी ।
कहीं आगरा यूनिवर्सिटी से RECOGNITION लनि पड़ेगी, कहीं लखनऊ यूनिवर्सिटी से लेनी पड़ेगी, चूँकि यह डीम्ड यूनिवर्सिटीज हैं, इसलियें इनके सामने मज़बूरी हैं की किसी न किसी यूनिवर्सिटी से उनको RECOGNITION लेनी ही पड़ेगी । मक्कड़जाल मैं आज कितना करप्शन हैं और एजुकेशन की कितनी बुरी स्थिति हैं,इसलायें, स्मृति जी, चाहूंगाकि कहीं न कहीं आप इस चाहूंगा कि कहीं न कहीं आप इस स्थिति से इसे बहार निकालियें । अब आप यह मत कहिएंगा कि पैसा नहीं हैं अथवा यह नहीं हैं । हमारा पास इतना बड़ा बजट हैं, इतना पैसा हैं और उसके बाद भी हम यह कह रहें कि पैसा नहीं हैं ।
आजकल एक नई चीज़ और शुरू हो गई है। जब हम लेन म जाते ह, तो बहुत सी पितर्काएं देखने को मिलती हैं, जैसे INDIA TODAY, OUTLOOK, BUSINESS STANDARD. इन पितर्काओं म वे तमाम कॉलेज का ग्रेडेशन करने लगे हैं कि नार्थ इंडिया मैं कौन सा कॉलेज नंबर 1-पर है, देश मैं कौन सा कॉलेज नंबर 1-पर है, विदेश मैं कौन सा कॉलेज न बर 1-पर है, नार्थ ईस्ट मैं कौन सा कॉलेज नंबर 1-पर है। स्मृति जी, क्या इस तरह ग्रेडेशन करने का कोई क्राइटेरिया है? जो कॉलेज ADVERTISEMENT के लियें इनको जितना ज्यादा पैसा दे दे, जो कॉलेज इनको जितनाज्यादा फायदा पहुंचा दे, उस कॉलेज का ग्रेडेशन उतना ऊँचा हो जाता है। यह तो बिल्कुल सीधे-सीधे छातर् के साथ छल है। जिसने इन मगज़ीन्स मे अपने को ग्रेडेशन मैं जितना ऊँचा कर लियां, उस कॉलेज मे उतने ही ज्यादा बच्चे जाने लगगे। इस देश मे यह कै सी बात हो गई है?
अब तो यह हो रहा है कि मीडिया और ज्यूडिशियरी, यही दोनो मिलकर सारी सरकार को चलाने लगे है। हम सब तो आज एक निर्बल की, असहाय की स्थिति में खड़े हो गए ह। ऐसा लग रहा हैकि अब हम कोई निर्यय ही नहीं ले पाएंगे, कोई ऐक्शन नहीं ले पाएंगे। ये चीज़ बहुत अच्छी नहीं होती हैं । प्रजातंत्र में, डेमोक्रेसी में जनता को मजबूत किया गया है और जनता को सर्वोच्च कहा गया है। डेमोक्रेसी मैं जनता का और जनता के द्वारा शासन रहता है। डेमोक्रेसी के, प्रजातंत्र के चार स्तम्भ होते है, लेकिन अगर उनम से कोई सबसे मजबूत स्तम्भ है, तो वह यह सदन है, यह सरकार है। सरकार और सदन ही अगर अपने को कमजोर समझने लगगे, तो वह अच्छा नहीं होगा।
मेरा आपसे सिर्फ इतना अनुरोध है, चुकी यह कोई बहुत भारी विषय नहीं है)... व्यवधान...(वह मैं आपको अलग से बता दूंगा । हम दोनों बहुत पुराने साथी है।
स्मृति जी, मैं आपसे कहना चाहूंगा, ठीक है, आप यह बिल ला रही ह और हम सब इसका समथर्न कर रहे ह। इसका समथर्न हम इसिलए कर रहे ह, क्यकि यह देश के हित मैं है, छातर् के हित मैं है। हम भी चाहते हैं कि हमारे देश का एजुकेशनल स्टैण्डर्ड बढ़े, अच्छे छातर् निकलें । पिछली बार भी हमने एक बात कही थीकि आज छात्र का जो विदेश की ओर पलायन हो रहा है, उसे जरूर रोक दिजिएंगा और आरक्षण की श्रेणी खत्म मत किरएगा। ऐसा न हो उपग्रडेशन के नाम पर आरक्षण को समाप्त ही कर दिया जाए।
इतना कहते हुए म अपनी बात समाप्त करूं गा मैंने अभी जो बात कही ह, यिद इन बिन्दुओ पर ध्यान देते हुए आप कुछ जवाब देने की कृपा करगी, तो मैं अनुगृहीत होऊँगा। मुझे विश्वास है कि कहीं न कहीं यह मील का पत्थर जरूर साबित होगा। धन्यवाद।
उपसभाध्यक्षडा.सत्यनारायणजिटया; “अनुगृहीतोअस्मि”। आपके भाषण के लिएं धन्यवाद।
PROF. JOGEN CHOWDHURY (WEST BENGAL): Mr. Vice-Chairman, Sir, I have been a Member of this House for about six months now. I have been patiently waiting for the right subject to deliver my maiden speech. Art is my passion and my profession.
Every Artist has a dream of having his painting displayed in the Museum in Paris. Every Indian citizen has a dream to be in this famous House of Parliament. Even though I am not a politician, I am grateful that I have been given the opportunity to come to Rajya Sabha. Amar Dhonnobadh to Mamati Manusha of Bengal, Amar Dhonnobadh to Mamata Banerjee who believes that people from different walks of life must be given a chance to express themselves here.
I welcome this legislation. I consider architecture is an important function for our lives and society. Good architecture makes a good city, town or a village or human settlements. It is instrumental in designing better living conditions and quality of lives of our people. It creates a good environment and makes us happy. Aesthetic beauty of architecture is a joy forever.
The present Bill which has been approved and passed by the Lok Sabha is mainly dealing with various technical and administrative matters. Administrative or technical matters apart, my main concern is architecture and teaching of architecture. This could be useful not only for the city people but also for a large number of people of this country who live in semi-urban and rural areas.
I would like to recall how important architecture was during the time of the great Greek, Roman and Renaissance periods, or even the time of the Egyptian Civilisation. In fact, art, architecture and design, all these three forms of art, were the basic components of those great civilizations. In the Renaissance Period, artists like Michelangelo or Leonardo Da Vinci, besides being great painters and sculptors, were also very well-qualified architects and designers.
Architecture of Egyptian cities on the banks of the Nile, or the architecture in Rome, Florence, Venice or Paris in the West, or our own Sanchi Stupa, Konark, Fatehpur Sikri, or our small-town traditional architectures like the wooden houses of Kerala, Tamil Nadu, or even in Bengal villages, were aesthetically great and extraordinarily beautiful. We could in fact, find beautiful village-architecture all over India in early times. China, Japan, Bhutan and Bali also have beautiful architecture. The Kings of Rajasthan created beautiful cities, palaces and forts. Even the Moghuls were great architects. We also have the planned city of New Delhi by Lutyens & Baker.
In recent times, institutions of planning and architecture are producing many architects every year. There are many good architects. They are also doing excellent work. But their activities are mainly centred in big cities and they construct buildings, apartments, hotels, etc., which are mostly for commercial purpose. In place of Maharajas or Kings, now the patrons are businessmen. There are many contemporary architects who make buildings without any character and aesthetic beauty, sometimes just following Western or foreign architecture. They also make good earnings out of their profession.
The most alarming and the worst situation is prevailing in the case of semi-urban townships and villages all over India. Small or large semi-urban townships are haphazardly growing and have no proper plan and design. Once beautiful traditional villages with ‘baroghor aikuthon’ where there was one planned courtyard with twelve homes, one temple or a Masjid, a community hall—we call it ‘archala’ in Bengali—are all transforming now into ugly-shaped haphazard constructions of rectangular-shaped brick structures as homes. They have no plan and aesthetic charm. The whole village has no proper planning. In fact, many of the villages due to development and economic growth are eager to make brick and concrete houses. But they have no plan. I understand that there is no Government plan yet to take appropriate action in this matter and save the traditionally beautiful hutments of rural India with new ideas, design and architectural planning.
I think it is most urgent for the Government to come forward and take certain measures in this regard. As per my idea, the Ministry of HRD will have to turn the first stone and initiate this matter.
Firstly, the School of Planning and Architecture should have a particular course for Teaching of Planning and Architectural Designing of Rural and Semi-Urban Townships and All Other Human Settlements, including designing of schools, markets, bridges, etc. Our idea should not be to transform rural villages into cities. That will be wrong. We must keep the quality and beauty of village life. Even the suburbs of London have beautiful hutments. Trained architects should be employed by the Government in each district Headquarter of the country. They should work in the office of District Magistrates (DM) and prepare architectural plans and designs as per the requirement of the locality, keeping the essential traditional architectural elements of the particular area and culture. Rules and regulations are to be framed accordingly. Bhutan or Bali could be good examples for us in this regard. I think the Smart City idea only sounds like an attractive plan. It is not enough to change the horizon of a vast number of semi-urban townships and rural India. Smart cities are a diversion. Finally, I would like to request the hon. Minister to establish the 4th School of Planning and Architecture in Eastern India and West Bengal, which I understand will be a School of Excellence under the Central Government. Unfortunately, West Bengal has no proper School of Planning & Architecture. The courses we have in Shibpur Engineering College/University and Jadavpur University are mainly dealing with construction side of architecture and do not deal much with the aesthetics of architecture. I hope the Minister will very kindly look into the matter and give me a time-bound response to this. My colleague, Shri K.D. Singh is moving an amendment to set up a school of planning and architecture in West Bengal.
Let me conclude by recalling what Madhavji’s idea of export of education is. I think if Indian educational institution can achieve excellence in standard, only then we can get international students to study here in India like Singapore and Western countries. There is all talk from the Government, it is good talk but there is not much visible action yet. We want something visible in the eastern part of India. Thank you.
THE VICE CHAIRMAN (DR. SATYANARAYAN JATIYA): Shrimati Vijila Sathyananth.
SHRIMATI VIJILA SATHYANANTH (TAMIL NADU): Sir, I start up with the same Maha Kavi Subramaniya Bharathiyar’s quote who was a revolutionary freedom poet, who says:
“anna chathiram aayiram vaithal Aalayam pathinayiram natal Pinnayavinum punniyam kodi Aangor ezhaikku ezhutharivthal”
Its meaning is, more than serving a thousand people with food, more than building ten thousand temples of faith, what is better is to educate an underprivileged person. Keeping these lines in mind, the Bill seeks to provide three existing SPAs in New Delhi, Bhopal and Vijayawada, the status of institutes of national importance. You know what it is going to do. It enables them to grant degrees to their students. Tamil Nadu is a land of temples and a living museum of styles that originated in the 7th century. The temples in Tamil Nadu, some of which are more than 1,700 years old, display intricate carving and sculptures, which bear testimony to the craftsmanship and creativity of the sculptures and artists of Tamil Nadu. The Pallavas, Cholas, Pandyas, Vijayanagar rulers and the Nayakas have made immense contributions to temple art in Tamil Nadu. Temples from the pre-Christian era as well as those from the 20th Century exist in this State, where the ancient rulers have made outstanding contributions to the growth of these monuments of great artistic value. The Shore temple of Mamallapuram is a UNESCO world heritage site.
Also, the Thanjavur Big Temple has been listed amongst UNESCO’s World Heritage sites. The Srirangam Temple, constructed in the Dravidian style of architecture, is glorified in the Thiviya Pirabandham. I also feel proud to say that we are sitting in this august House, under the roof of a great architectural structure of the country, the Parliament House building. This temple of democracy was constructed between 12th February, 1921 and 18th January, 1927. Two famous architects, Sir Edwin Lutyens and Sir Herbert Baker from France and England designed and raised this building which has the aesthetic blending of both the Western and the Eastern traditional architecture. Apart from that, it also has the Indian touch. The wonderful windows, in the various forms of marble jaalis, depict the wonderful Indian touch, and the great Indian tradition has been established. This monument building can richly contribute to any school of architecture.
Sir, thanks to our most beloved leader, the architect of Tamil Nadu, Dr. Puratchi Thalaivi Amma, the higher education sector in Tamil Nadu is moving at an accelerated pace to meet the demands of the century in terms of research and development. In keeping with the vision of our hon. leader to make Tamil Nadu the innovation hub and the knowledge capital of India, she said and I quote: “without a body of sufficiently skilled and balanced workforce, no economy can hope to develop its potential.” I would point out the Tamil Nadu model, which is Amma’s achievements in her regime as the Chief Minister, how she had taken the Universities towards total excellence!...(Time-bell)... Sir, in line with her Vision, she implemented Smart Classrooms with Video Conferencing facilities. These have been established in ten Universities at a cost of Rs.2 crores. Also, enterpreneurship has been developed. Twenty-five students and five faculty members have been selected to study one semester in the Universities in the United Kingdom from September, 2013 to January, 2014. A total of 3,35,086 laptop computers were distributed to the students. By this way, Tamil Nadu could achieve the Gross Enrolment Ratio of 38.2 per cent. In the whole of India, it is only 18 per cent. In 2011, Tamil Nadu had a GER of 18 per cent; now, it is 38.2 per cent. That is the biggest achievement of our former Chief Minister and our great leader. India has only 18 per cent Gross Enrolment Ratio and in spite of being a densely populated State,—Goa may be ranked first with 40 per cent, but it is a Union Territory and has a less populated area – Tamil Nadu has the GER of 38.2 per cent. And, as far as the country’s average GER is concerned, it was 15 per cent in 2011 and, now, it is 18 per cent. So, comparatively, Tamil Nadu stands first in the Gross Enrolment Ratio in higher education. I want to reiterate that. Over a period of three years, a total of 23,53,970 laptops, amounting to Rs.2,500 crores, have been distributed to students who were wanting to pursue higher education,. That is the greatest achievement because of which the Gross Enrolment Ratio went up. Also, MoUs between students and faculty members and foreign professors of repute have been introduced in ten Universities at a cost of Rs.1 crore. All the more, I want to point out here that in the year 2013-14, Amma has sanctioned about Rs.20,000 crores to the Education Department...
THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (DR. SATYANARAYAN JATIYA): Your time is over. Please co-operate.
SHRIMATI VIJILA SATHYANANTH: While in 2010, the allocation for the education sector was only to the extent of Rs.10,000 crores, in 2014, it has been doubled and an allocation of Rs.20,000 crores has been made for upgrading school education. So, in line with her Vision 2023, Smart Classrooms with Video Conferencing facilities have been introduced. Foreign laboratories have been established in ten Universities.
Entrepreneurship-cum-skill development centres have been improved. (Time-bell) Sir, I will end here. We request the hon. Minister, who is dynamic—I know she is a wonderful artist too and I applaud her—for a Tamil Nadu School of Planning and Architecture as the premier, central institution for the South, as the region, i.e. Tamil Nadu, will have a regional central institution for the South and is known for mixing architecture with the art of sculpting. This is my chanting of this prayer to this House through you, Sir, and with these words I support this Bill. Thank you.
SHRI AMBETH RAJAN (UTTAR PRADESH): Sir, I am thankful to my Party, leader and National President Kumari Mayawati for giving me an opportunity to participate in the discussion on this Bill. I am also very thankful to the Chair for permitting me to take part in the participation. I also congratulate Madam Minister for scoring a hat-trick because this will be the third Bill to be passed today. It must be passed. I hope so.
Madam, in the Statement of Objects and Reasons, it has been stated that the School of Planning and Architecture, New Delhi, is a premier institution in the field of Planning and Architecture. It was established in 1959 as an autonomous society, registered under the Societies Registration Act, 1860. In 1979, the School was conferred with the status of “Deemed University.” Madam, I have one question. Since 1959 the School of Planning and Architecture is functioning. Fifty-five academic years have passed. In all these 55 years, students got admitted, studied and got degrees. Whether, during these 55 years, reservation in admission was followed or not. I would like to have a clarification from the Minister regarding this and I also expect details of SC/ST students who were admitted, particularly students admitted in this school. I presume the schools in Vijayawada and Madhya Pradesh, which were established in 2008, would have hardly followed the reservation policy. Madam, I would like to bring to your notice that when our party leader and National President, Kumari Mayawati, was CM of Uttar Pradesh, Gautam Buddha University, which has a unique architecture, was established in Uttar Pradesh. That time, reservation policy was adopted correctly in students’ admission, faculty recruitment and all other recruitments.
I would like to add one more point as our colleague from Tamil Nadu spoke about Mahabalipuram, Srirangam and many places. I request Madam Minister to visit Lucknow and see for herself world class grand architecture design which finds place in the grand monuments like Dr. Ambedkar Smarak, Manyawar Sri Kanshiram Ji Smarak Sthal, Baudh Sthal etc. They have been erected under the able and personal guidance and supervision of our leader, Behen Kumari Mayawatiji during the last tenure, when she was Chief Minister of Uttar Pradesh.
Madam, having said this, I now come to Section 12. The Section states that a Board of Governors and a Senate will be authorities of the schools. Section 13(2) deals with the composition of the Board of Governors. In these 12 clauses, there is no mention about Scheduled Castes and Scheduled Tribes. (Time-bell).
Sir, I will complete. I have only two points. (Time bell)
श्रीसतीशचन्द्रमिश्रा; घंटी! सर, आप तो कमाल कर रहे ह।...(व्यवधान)
उपसभाध्यक्ष (डा. सत्यनारायणजटिया ): जितना समय मुझे दिया गया है, उतना ही समय तो म दे पाऊंगा।
SHRI SATISH CHANDRA MISRA: Sir, we are cooperating. But, even then you are ringing the bell. कोई अगर बोलता है, तो दो घंटे तक बोलता रहेगा और अभी तीन मिनट के समय मैं एक मिनट क्रॉस भी नहीं हुआ है और आपकी घंटी बज गई। मान्यवर, यह तो उचित नहीं है। मैं आपसे सम्मान के साथ कह रहा हूँ।
उपसभाध्यक्ष (डा. सत्यनारायणजटिया ): जो समय दियां गया है, उसी मैं खत्म करना है।
श्रीसतीशचन्द्रमिश्रा; आप दो मिनट का सब्र कर लीजिये, आधे मिनट का सब्र कर लीजिये।
उपसभाध्यक्ष (डा. सत्यनारायणजटिया): ससब्रतो मेरे पास बहुत है, ससब्रकी कहां कमी है।..(व्यवधान ).. इनके पास के वल दो मिनट का समय है।...(व्यवधान)...कि सी के लियें ऐसा नहीं है। मुझे जो समय दियां गया है, उसी पर मुझे चलना है।...(व्यवधान)... के वल दो मिनट का समयदियां गया है।...(व्यवधान)...
SHRI AMBETH RAJAN: I will cooperate. Now, I am finishing it; don’t worry.
Sir, there is no reservation for SC/ST under clause 12. This is totally against the Constitution. Sir, same is the case with regard to Senate under clause 16. There is also no mention about representation of SC/ST in the Senate.
Now, I come to the Council proposed under clause 33. Clause 33 deals with establishment of Council. It also says about composition of the Council. It includes all those who are closely connected with planning, architecture and construction. It is a very good step. But, here also, representation from SC/ST is ‘nil’. Dr. Ambedkar, architect of the Indian Constitution, always thought of their upliftment and fought for reservation. Madam, please have a re-look at clauses 12, 13 and 33 only then people will look at you.
Sir, there are various institutions and Deemed Universities which are offering B.Arch. courses across the country. I would like to know whether the Council, which will be established under clause 33 of the Bill, will have the power to exercise control over all those institutions which are offering B.Arch courses. Sir, there is a need to have uniform syllabus pattern in India for the course being offered.
Sir, we are witnessing rapid urbanisation. Wherever urbanisation is taking place, we are facing many constraints. All these are happening because of lack of planning. Planning should be given top priority in syllabus. Uniformity across institution will ensure systematic planning in the country. So, I urge the hon. Minister to think over this aspect.
THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (DR. SATYANARAYAN JATIYA): Rajanji, please conclude.
SHRI AMBETH RAJAN: Sir, only one sentence. Please, don’t press the bell.
While the Government is planning to have these institutes of national importance, I request you to take necessary steps to ensure national benefit. Why am I saying this? I am saying this because after becoming scholars, students are going after dollars.
With these words, I conclude my speech. Thank you.
SHRI RITABRATA BANERJEE (WEST BENGAL): Sir, I rise to support this Bill which is timely and praiseworthy endeavour.
Hon. Members have dealt about its necessity. As urbanisation is going on such institutes, with new vision and new ideas emphasizing on research, development and promotion, are needed. I just want to mention here one point that the provision of student council to ensure redressal mechanism needs to be there.
One point I want to mention here. When we are discussing higher education, architecture in our country is rooted in our history and culture. It is an assimilation of diversities. It is an assimilation of different influences. I was hearing about Indus Valley Civilization where we had town planning. After that, post-Mohenjo-daro and Ashoka the Great assimilated the blending of the Roman and Hellenic influences came giving birth to the Greco Buddhist School. Then, we had the Muslim influence, the Mughal era, where India and Iran uniting the Colonial era where the British, the Dutch, the French and the Portuguese giving birth to the Indo Gothic Structure. Now, the point is, this assimilation has been the churning crucible of our civilization as the BBC’s Ethic History points out that India is the only continuing civilization in human history. I just want to mention here, during the period of 6th Century BC to 6th Century AD, spectacular scientific developments took place in our country.
The question naturally arises as to why it stopped in the Seventh Century A.D. Because intolerance was there. When intolerance took place, then there is a stoppage of scientific advancement. Particularly, I just want to mention a famous book, The Biography of a Dangerous Idea, written by a French intellectual, Charles Seife. This dangerous idea is actually zero which we have invented. The Arabs took that idea from us. They have always credited us for that idea.
As we are discussing architecture, wherever this zero came into being, this zero is incomplete without the concept of infinity in mathematics. Infinity and zero go together. That is dialectics, that is the unity of the opposite, that is always cherished by our country. Particularly when we speak about the unity of the opposites, the dialects, because the dialects and unity of opposites generate the advancement of ideas, we need to move forward towards this advancement of ideas. I urge upon the Government to see to it that as we move forward with the advancement of ideas with more increased spending on education along with more social spending, there is a situation where the tolerance is championed. This is the need of the hour. I want to quote Tagore. Tagore has said in his celebrated poem of Bharata Teertha:1
No one knows, Sir, from where it flows or who set it in motion, the wild force of humanities course to mingle in mid-ocean, here are Aryans and non-Aryans, Mughals, people of the East and Huns and Syrians, Pathans and Dravidians, in a body they are mixed.
So, naturally, our first Prime Minister, Pandit Nehru, had always mentioned and I quote him. Even after our Independence in a Convocation in Allahabad University, he said, ‘A university stands for humanism, it stands for tolerance, it stands for reason, it stands for the adventure of ideas and the search for truth.’
I rise to support this timely and praiseworthy endeavour and an important one that will definitely take us into the higher planes of civilization. Thank you, Sir.
SHRI C.M. RAMESH (TELANGANA): Sir, thank you for giving me this opportunity. This is a very important Bill. There is one college in Vijayawada. It is going to be our Capital. Sir, I wish to congratulate hon. Minister for HRD for piloting the School of Planning and Architecture Bill, 2014 which has been pending for more than six years. I express my sincere thanks for responding positively when I brought to her notice the plight of the students of SPA, Vijayawada through my letter and personal representation. The students of SPA, Bhopal, and SPA, Vijayawada, have been suffering due to the disinterestedness of the earlier Government and till date, they are not getting their degrees as the institutes are not conferred with the powers to award degrees. Now, with this Bill, the students can get their degrees. In this context, I appreciate the vision of the hon. Minister to constitute an SPA Council, on the lines of IIT Council, with the Directors of all SPAs—New Delhi, Bhopal and Vijayawada—professionals and elected members to guide Government on how to make these institutions Centres of Excellence.
Today, there is an immense need for qualified planners and architects in our country with growing urbanization. All our cities are crumbling with unplanned growth and lack of infrastructure to cope up with the minimum needs of the citizens. These institutions are to be directed to guide the urban development in close contact with the Urban Local Bodies instead of remaining as mere educational institutions. The interaction and guidance with the day-to-day problems of ULBs will enrich both the faculty and students and it will be helpful to the society. I appeal to the hon. Minister that the SPA Act shall, ipso facto, confer the recognition of SPA courses by professional bodies like Council of Architecture, and Indian Town Planners’ Association.
It should also confer the recognition of SPA courses by AICTE-like Government Organisations, without insisting on applications and inspections in a routine manner. All the courses started in these shall be deemed to be recognised by these bodies. The earlier batches, for example, of SPA, Bhopal and SPA, Vijayawada do not have any recognition from Council of Architecture hindering students’ registration with the COA and pursue their professional career. These batches shall be given recognition by COA and hon. Minister may direct the COA to do the same at the earliest. Till date, SPA, Vijayawada and SPA, Bhopal are not recognised by AICTE, though, all these organisations are financed and controlled by the Ministry of HRD. The students of SPAs are not getting scholarship from AICTE and quality programmes are not extended to them. The SPA students are facing problems while getting admission in foreign universities as some institutions are insisting on approval of the courses from AICTE. India is rapidly getting urbanised and unless we take preparatory steps to place professionals to take up this challenge, our cities will never become livable cities. I also request the hon. Minister for HRD to direct the SPA, Vijayawada to associate itself with the development of world class capital city for Andhra Pradesh being promoted by our beloved Chief Minister of Andhra Pradesh, Shri Chandrababu Naidu. Let me once again congratulate the hon. Minister for her interest in promoting higher education and I am confident that she will transform the entire higher education sector with her able leadership. Sir, just now my colleague from Tamil Nadu said that former Chief Minister Amma did many things, we expect this Amma will also do the same things.
उपसभाध्यक्ष (डा. सत्यनारायणजिटया); थैंक्यू । श्री भूपिंदर सिंह जी, बोलिए। सबके लियें दो-दो मिनट का समय दिया गया है। यह मेरी बाध्यता है की मैं दो मिनट के बाद ... चुंकि आप सब नेता ह और वहां समय तय करते ह, वही समय मैं यहां बताता हूं, इसिलएकि सी को नाराज़ होने की जरूरत नहीं है।...(व्यवधान)... लीज़... (व्यवधान)... भूपिंदर सिंह जी, बोलिए।
SHRI BHUPINDER SINGH (ODISHA): Hon. Vice Chairman, Sir, I have been thinking time and again, why the name of the Bill is the School of Planning and Architecture. I would like to draw the attention of the entire House, including the hon. Minister and the Government that it should have been named as Knowledge Planning and Architecture University or something like that, not a School. I must thank at the outset, the autonomous society who started the first school in 1959. Five decades after that, the second and third Schools of Planning and Architecture, Bhopal and Vijayawada came into being. As Minister of Urban Development in my State in 1999, while saying goodbye to the twentieth Century, my vision for 2020 was, what would be the size of urban India. The rural people are rushing towards the cities. Sometime we talk about planning. Only those can plan, who have vision. Without vision there cannot be any planning. My city, Bhubaneshwar, the Capital city is known as the temple city of India. I can claim that it is the temple city of the world from where Jainism, Buddhism, everything has come up. We are talking about 300-400 years back. Go back to the age when the architecturers made Konark Temple in 12th Century. Konark Temple is one of the world class monuments recognised by UNESCO.
There are so many temples made by our architects, and, unfortunately, for the two Central Government schools, which have been mentioned by the previous speaker, AICTE approval is not there. Where are we then? It is really a matter of shame for us. If the Central Government institutions are neglected by the AICTE, and our students will not get degrees, then, after coming out of those colleges, what will be their fate? So, I would like to tell the hon. Minister that the Sun rises from my State, i.e., Chandrabhaga, near Konark. I am making an appeal to the hon. Minister. I have been seeing in this House for the last six months that East and Eastern India is not there in the map of any proposal which is coming here. Why is it so? What for is it so? So, should we bring a motion here for that purpose? I would like to request the hon. Minister that at least a Central School of Planning should be there in Odisha.
Sir, it has been mentioned in Clause 11 of the Bill that the President of India shall be the Visitor of every school. So, here the Visitor is the first citizen of this country, His Excellency. I would like to request that if it is not the Visitor, then, some other name other than the Visitor can be found out.
Sir, the Delhi School of Planning has been made a deemed to be university after 20 years. (Time-bell) For the information of the House, I would like to say that the deemed to be university means the university will make its own syllabus; it will conduct its own examinations; and its results will be prepared by it; it can give any marks and any degrees to its students. But, the students of Bhopal and Vijayawada have to go through the other channel. So, Sir, I demand that there should be uniformity in the syllabus; there should be uniformity in examinations; there should be uniformity in results also. That is what is lacking here.
THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (DR. SATYANARAYAN JATIYA): Please conclude.
SHRI BHUPINDER SINGH: If it continues, then, the students studying in the Central Government-run schools will not get proper degrees, and they will fail.
Though I would not like to mention here, but still I would say that our education system has become more commercial than a place of learning and place of information. It is rather going towards commercialization. We have to check that. I congratulate the hon. Minister for bringing forward such a Bill. In fact, it should have been brought long, long back. We have to wait five decades for it. If there is no planning, then, many things happen. Today, this House is concerned about natural calamities in Uttarakhand, Srinagar and Hudhud in Andhra and Odisha. (Time-bell) Sir, just give me one more minute.
Sir, we talk about man-made floods in cities. Why does it come? It is because we are not having planning for our cities. Have you done any planning for 500 smart cities? Do the small townships which are looked after by urban bodies have any planning? We are closing the natural ways of water sources to the towns. This causes flood inside the cities; this causes flood inside urban areas. So, we call it man-made calamity. The answer is, we should have proper planning and proper architect for the cities. Today, Sir, the 21st century demands that we should include the subject of vastu into our syllabus because without vastu there cannot any architectural building in future. So, I would like to request the hon. Minister to add ‘vastu’ in this subject. With these words, on behalf of my party, I support this Bill. Thank you, Sir.
SHRIMATI KANIMOZHI (TAMIL NADU): Sir, the first speaker who started to speak on this Bill spoke about scientific temper, and the speaker just before me, talked about including vastu.
THE MINISTER OF HUMAN RESOURCE DEVELOPMENT (SHRIMATI SMRITI ZUBIN IRANI): He also spoke about vastu.
SHRIMATI KANIMOZHI: No, he spoke about astrology.
SHRIMATI SMRITI ZUBIN IRANI: He also spoke about vastu.
SHRIMATI KANIMOZHI: I really hope that the hon. Minister keeps in mind that maintaining scientific temper among the students is more important than anything else.
Sir, I would like to bring to the notice of the Minister, through you, that in India we have so many buildings but we do not build them as universal friendly building, which are disabled friendly. According to the Census of 2011, there are 26.81 million people with disabilities in India, but they are invisible. This invisibility is mainly due to inaccessible infrastructural facilities that we have in this country. Even the new buildings which are built and the old buildings which are already existing, we do not care about them and making them hurdle-free. These may be school buildings, Government buildings. Even when you go to hospitals, there are a lot of difficulties which disabled people have to face. Under the United Nations Convention on Protection and Promotion of Rights and Dignity of Persons with Disabilities, India has committed to provide accessible infrastructure to persons with disabilities as a right. Therefore, there is a need to promote research, learning and implementation of universal design for construction in such buildings. This has to be a part of the curriculum and it has to be made mandatory for the students of architecture.
Another point is that the Government has announced more than 100 smart cities. Urbanisation is very important part of today’s world. Every city is becoming bigger and developing, but nothing is done about planning. That is of great concern in Tamil Nadu. In the city of Chennai, I am not talking of the present Government...
SHRI A. NAVANEETHAKRISHNAN: No, no. ...(Interruptions)...
SHRIMATI KANIMOZHI: Oh! God. ...(Interruptions)... Please....(Interruptions)... Chennai city was started 125 years ago....(Interruptions)... We celebrated this occasion. ...(Interruptions)... Sir, I am talking about Tamil Nadu....(Interruptions)... Chennai was there 125 years ago....(Interruptions)...
SHRI A. NAVANEETHAKRISHNAN: I am sorry, no, no. ...(Interruptions)... This is not correct. ...(Interruptions)...
THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (DR. SATYANARAYAN JATIYA): Please sit down....(Interruptions)... Let her speak. ...(Interruptions)...
SHRIMATI KANIMOZHI: They are not allowing me....(Interruptions)... They are wasting my time. ...(Interruptions)...
THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (DR. SATYANARAYAN JATIYA): You make your point. ...(Interruptions)...
SHRIMATI KANIMOZHI: Chennai is not a planned city. It was built at the same time....(Interruptions)...
THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (DR. SATYANARAYAN JATIYA): You make your point. ...(Interruptions)... Please sit down....(Interruptions)...
SHRIMATI KANIMOZHI: I am talking about the period 125 years before when there was British Rule. ...(Interruptions)... What is she talking about?...(Interruptions)... Did I say anything when you were speaking?...(Interruptions)...
SHRIMATI SASIKALA PUSHPA: She is not talking to you directly. ...(Interruptions)... Through you only, Sir, she is making her point....(Interruptions)...
DR. K.P. RAMALINGAM: Why are you unnecessarily interrupting her?...(Interruptions)...
THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (DR. SATYANARAYAN JATIYA): Address the Chair. ...(Interruptions)...
SHRI A. NAVANEETHAKRISHNAN: The law is important....(Interruptions)...
THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (DR. SATYANARAYAN JATIYA): Address the Chair....(Interruptions)... If there is anything wrong, we will see it. ...(Interruptions)... Let her make her point....(Interruptions)... Please sit down....(Interruptions)...
SHRIMATI KANIMOZHI: Sir, the city of Chennai has celebrated 175 years.
SHRIMATI VIJILA SATHYANANTH: 375 years.
SHRIMATI KANIMOZHI: Thank you for the correction, it is 375 years. We are not talking of any recent Government here....(Interruptions)... We are talking about the point that the city of Chennai is not a planned city. It is a place where different villages came together and grown into one big city. So, there has not been any proper planning. I am just giving this as an example. When there is rain nearly half the city gets submerged.
SHRIMATI VIJILA SATHYANANTH: Now she is again talking about it....(Interruptions)...
SHRI A. NAVANEETHAKRISHNAN: Chennai is the right place to live....(Interruptions)...
SHRIMATI KANIMOZHI: I am living in Chennai, Sir....(Interruptions)... Okay, I will speak about the past....(Interruptions)...
THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (DR. SATYANARAYAN JATIYA): She is not yielding. Please sit down....(Interruptions)... If there is anything objectionable,...(Interruptions)... I am not allowing you.
SHRI A. NAVANEETHAKRISHNAN (CONTD.): She is giving a distorted version....(Interruptions)...
THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (DR. SATYANARAYAN JATIYA): Okay. Please sit down. ...(Interruptions)... You will get a chance to speak, when you turn comes. ...(Interruptions)... Shrimati Kanimozhi, now conclude please. ...(Interruptions)...
SHRIMATI KANIMOZHI: Sir, there are so many interruptions. I am not talking about the present Government. There is no politics involved. Why are they interrupting? You please bring the House in order, if you want me to continue....(Interruptions)...
THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (DR. SATYANARAYAN JATIYA): I amalso asking for that....(Interruptions)...
SHRIMATI KANIMOZHI: I am just speaking, but I am being interrupted. Please let me speak.
Sir, with so many Smart Cities, which have been announced, I think, it is very important to include in the curriculum of architectural students to make sure that they learn about town planning, so that there are no problems in any of our cities, in future. The most important thing is that they have to find ways to rectify the storm water drains and ensure proper maintenance. So, all these things have to be taken into consideration. (Time-bell)
THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (DR. SATYANARAYAN JATIYA): Please, conclude....(Interruptions)...
SHRIMATI KANIMOZHI: Sir, lot of my time has been wasted....(Interruptions)...
THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (DR. SATYANARAYAN JATIYA): Okay. But finally conclude now.
SHRIMATI KANIMOZHI: There is a need for conservation and preservation. As Indians, we do not realize the value of our heritage buildings. We do not maintain them. We do not restore them. The walls of old granite temples, which were built by the early Cholas, were built by ball and socket method. There is no stronger way of building our temples than the ball and socket method. But the people, who had taken up renovation work in such temples, have actually plastered them with cement. At many places, in the name of kumbhabhishekam, they have actually sandblasted the paintings, which were over 500-600 years old. We have lost them forever. So, it is very important that we concentrate on restoration without destroying our heritage. I think, it is not important that just the architectural students only learn about this, rather every engineering student has to be taught its importance, because most of the time, it is the PWDA engineers who actually end up doing this job. They also have to be taught how to preserve and how to restore without hurting the buildings. (Time-bell)
THE VICE-CHAIRMAN (DR. SATYANARAYAN JATIYA): Okay. Thank you....(Interruptions)...
SHRIMATI KANIMOZHI: Sir, just one more minute. We must attract more talent in the field of conservation. Everybody goes into building new structures, and not many students are attracted in the field of restoration. I think, the Government and the Minister have to do something to make it more lucrative and more interesting so that a lot of young talent comes into the field of restoration and preservation.
PROF. M.V. RAJEEV GOWDA (KARNATAKA): Sir, I rise insupport of the passage of the School of Planning and Architecture Bill, 2014. Being the proud husband of an architect, my children’s amma, I am aware what a wonderful and creative people architects are. I would like to offer some concrete suggestions to enable the SPA Bill to become more effective.
First, I come to the faculty-related issues. For any educational institution to achieve its potential, it needs motivated and capable students, outstanding teachers and wonderful infrastructure. But attracting faculty for teaching is not easy. Today, the Government regulations are coming into the way of SPAs to attract the best talent. Let me explain how. The architecture is a field which is a professional field. Rule, applied to professional courses, should take into account the context of where knowledge is created. And, in architecture, knowledge is created in the field.
In professions like architecture, knowledge is created in the field. So, if you want to get the best practitioners who are at the cutting edge of knowledge into the classroom, you have to have regulations opened up in the classroom to practitioners. You should change the regulations that prevent the teachers from taking part in private practice or even institutional and Government practice. Today, faculty members are discouraged from engaging in practice and this must be reversed.
Another aspect of faculty development in SPAs is this. If this is a profession, as a practice, then, a PhD should not necessarily be the requirement for a faculty position. There will be numerous practising architects who would not have a Ph.D but whose knowledge and experience would be more valuable than those with a PhD. I speak as a Ph.D myself. I urge the Government to bring in more flexibility in its requirements, so that outstanding practitioners can be brought back to the classrooms of the SPAs.
Sir, the second point is about urbanization. India is going through rapid urbanization, but it is happening with little planning and vision. Urban design is turning out to be the ghastly by- product of self-interested actions of real estate developers. Green design is becoming a game of certification rather than something that protects the environment. Sustainability and environment pay the price and so do the citizens.
It is imperative that SPAs play a more active role in working with urban planning authorities so that our cities grow in a manner that respects their natural ecosystems. It is imperative to integrate large-scale public transport into the cities as they grow. It is imperative to create public spaces that enable people to interact and play together, the spaces which encourage building up of social capital across communities. It is imperative to ensure that cities proactively plan for migrants and to create proper living spaces for construction workers who work and build the structures that they will never get to live or work in. We also need the SPAs to help create an urban planning and management cadre of professionals. Those professionals should be integrated into the Government and the relevant Government Department professionals should also be sent to the SPAs for mandatory executive education. We also need the SPAs to diversify the curriculum to bring in geography, informatics, economics, development studies, mass communications, etc. to make education in Planning and Architecture a much more holistic endeavour than it is today.
On the issue of smart cities, my colleague, Shri Shantaram Naik, has already spoken. So, I will move on to the fact that the Minister really needs to go beyond the three SPAs that exist today and create many more such institutions around the country including in Karnataka. In Karnataka, in Bangalore, we already have private sector initiative through philanthropy, the Indian Institute of Human Settlements, which is doing cutting-edge research on urbanization and engaging with international universities and coming up with programmes that are really meaningful to India’s evolving context. At the same time, Sir, we need the SPAs to pay more attention to certain other contexts to which we are paying less attention today. We are seeing development in the mountain areas. Whether it is the North- East of Himalayas, we need our top institutions to pay attention to development plans and design that ensure that those ecosystems are not hurt and that we do not face natural disasters going forward. Going beyond the mountains, the very topography of our country offers a huge canvas for innovative architecture, for design and planning that is suited to the context of deserts, forests, coasts, hills, the Western ghats and even our islands. At the same time, Sir, we must ensure that disaster management is integrated into the curriculum of these institutions. They have to be at the forefront of disaster planning and work hand in hand with the National Disaster Management Authority to ensure it not just within those institutions, but even in the new institutions it needs to be brought in because we are facing more and more challenges in the context of climate change. While I talk about urbanization, I do not want to leave my village brethren behind. We have to look at village and local architecture. We need to ensure that our villages incorporate the best of our learnings. We need to ensure that we strengthen or diverse locally-relevant architectural heritage. We should stop aping the West.
We should ensure that the SPAs play a leading role in creating built environments where people and nature come alive harmoniously. (Time-bell)Sir, India is a country with an extraordinary architectural heritage unrivalled in the world. From Mohenjodaro to the Mughal monuments, from Khajuraho to Konark to Karnataka’s Hampi and Halebid, even our Parliament House, India has shown what kind of extraordinary architects we can produce. We have revered architects in Karnataka like Jakanacharya. Let their example be the inspiration for the SPAs as they embark on their new mission to be institutions of national importance. I wish them the very best and commend this Bill to the House for passage. Thank you.
श्रीमेघराजजैन (मध्यप्रदेश ); आदरणीय उपसभाध्यक्ष महोदय, योजना और वास्तु, ये दो अलग-अलग विषय है। योजना शहर को बसाने के बारे म होती है और वास्तु भवन को बनाने के बारे मैं होता है। वास्तुकला एक महत्वपूर्ण विद्या है, जिसके द्वारा वास्तुविद अपनी कल्पना को आकार देता है। अलग-अलग क पना के आधार पर अलग-अलग कार से वह भवन को स्वरूप प्रदान करता है।
मनुष्य का स्वभाव हैं — अच्छी से अच्छी चीज़ देखना, प्राप्त करना और उसमे रहना। इसके लियें वास्तु का बड़ा महत्व है। योग्य वास्तुकार किसी नगर या बस्ती की रचना मैं चौड़ी सडको, नालियो , ड्रेनेज, धुप, हवा, पानी, रोशनी, प्राकृतिक दृश्यों, बगीचों को ध्यान मैं रखकर योजना बनाता है।
आज शहर और गाव का विकास तेजी से हो रहा है। नई-नई कॉलोनियों तथा बस्तिओं के निर्माण के साथ-साथ गाव म मकान का निर्माण हो रहा है,कि न्तु वे नियोजित नहीं हैं । अगर वास्तुविदों के माध्यम से इनका निर्माणहो, तो कभी भी आपातकाल में, जैसे अग्नि, बाढ़, भूकम्प अथवा अन्य किसी दुघर्टना के समय मे वहां पर वाहन का सुगमता से आना-जाना हो सकता है। आज अवशयकता है कि योजनापूवर्क नये नगर एवं गाव का विकास हो और इसके लियें अधिक मात्रा मै वास्तुविदों की आवश्यकता होगी। ऐसी अवस्था मै इन विधलयों का महत्व और भी बढ़ जाता है।
अनुसंधानों तथा अध्ययन से इन विधालयों को अंतर्राष्ट्रीय तर का बनाया जा सकेगा। इसम एक बोर्ड का भी गठन होगा,जीसमे विशेषज्ञ रखे जा सकगे। इससे शिक्षा का तर और भी उन्नत होगा। इन विज्ञालयो से निकलने वाले छात्र को डिग्री प्राप्त हो सके गी, जिससे उनको सरकारी, गैर- सरकारी तथा वतंतर् रूप से रोजगार प्राप्त करने मे सुविधा होगी। प्राचीन काल में भी वास्तुशास्त्र का अध्ययन होता था । भारत थता अन्य देशों मैं जो भव्य इमारतें हैं, वे वास्तुकला के बेजोड़ नमुने हैं । भारत के किले, उनमे पानी संग्रह करने के स्थान, गुप्त मार्ग, दक्षिण भारत के भव्य मन्दिर, राजस्थान के भव्य मंदिर, जैसलमेर की हवेलिआ, जोधपुर चित्तोड़ के किल्ले, क़ुतुब मीनार और ताजमहल आदि वास्तुकला के अचम्मित करने वाले उदहारण हैं । हमारे संसद भवन, राष्ट्रपति भवन, नार्थ ब्लॉक, साउथ ब्लॉक भी वास्तुकला के ही कमाल हैं।
वास्तु मैं भवनों की सुरक्षा के साथ-साथ हवा, पानी और रौशनी की पर्याप्त व्यवस्था का विचार होता हैं,जिससे कई इमारतें सर्दी मैं गर्म तथा गर्मी मैं ठंडी रहती है। राजस्थान के मारवाड़ मैं वर्षा का पानी संग्रह करने की विद्या का अध्यनन का आज के जल संकट एवं शुद्ध पानी के आभाव देखते हुए बड़ा महत्व हैं ।
मेरा माननीय मंत्री महोदया से निवेदन हैं की वास्तुशास्त्र और आधुनिक तकनिकी ज्ञान का समावेश वर्तमान समय की आवश्यकता हैं । परम्परागत रूप से इस व्यसाय मैं लगे लोग एवं सोमपुरा समुदाय के लोग पीढ़ी दर पीढ़ी से यह कार्य कर रहे हैं । यदि आप बच्चो को भी इन विद्यालयों मैं प्रवेश लेने हेतु प्रोत्साहित करेंगे, तो अति उत्तम होगा । इन विद्यालयों के विद्यार्थीओ को उच्च प्राचीन तकनिकी ज्ञान से अवगत कराने के लिए यदि उन स्थानों का भ्रमण करवाया जाय , तो और भी अधिक उचित होगा ।
मैं आशा करता हूं की इस विद्यालय के निर्माण मैं इन सब विषयों को ध्यान मैं रक्खा जाएगा ।इन्हि शब्दों के साथ, मैं इस विधेयक का समर्थन करता हूं ।
SHRI M.P. ACHUTHAN (KERALA): Sir, I want to draw the attention of the Minister only to one aspect of this Bill. The function of SPA is to undertake research and innovations in architecture planning, design and allied activities. Now, the very concept of architecture is only meant for big buildings in cities. This concept has to be changed. Now, there is a boom in the building sector, in real estate, and the main aim is to meet the desires of a small section of the society, that is, the upper middle class, the rich and the super rich. We are ignoring the vast majority of our people. Now, we have to focus on the needs of the common people, on building houses for them and on their housing problems. How will this institution be utilized to meet the demands of the growing number of people in the villages, in the urban areas and slums and how can we plan buildings to meet their demands? That must be one of the main aims of this institution. For that, there must be a change in our attitude. Just thinking about smart cities, big cities and huge buildings to cater to the needs of the big people will not serve the masses. The masses need small houses, affordable houses, pocket-friendly houses, with solar energy and rainwater harvesting facilities, and so on. Such buildings need to be constructed. How is your research going to help these people? That must be the aim. Otherwise, we can say that we have built huge buildings, architecture, monuments, etc. and boost ourselves, but it won’t serve the society. So, there must be a change of attitude, a change of vision, and if, through this Bill, the Minister takes appropriate action to fulfill the growing demands of the masses, then it would be of great help.
Thank you, Sir.
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Thank you, Mr. Achuthan. Now, hon. Minister.
SHRI A. NAVANEETHAKRISHNAN: Sir, before that, with your permission, I would like to say just one thing. This Bill deals with design, planning and architecture. Regarding water conservation, as rightly pointed out by my colleague here, there must be a specific syllabus in the School of Planning and Architecture. In Tamil Nadu, there is an Act called the Rainwater Harvesting Act. So, in each and every plan there must be a provision for rainwater harvesting. So, that may be included. This is my humble submission. Thank you.
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Yes, yes. Now, the Minister, please.
THE MINISTER OF HUMAN RESOURCE DEVELOPMENT (SHRIMATI SMRITI ZUBIN IRANI): Sir, at the outset, through you, I would like to thank all the hon. Members who have expressed their views, given their suggestions and some who have expressed concerns, vis-a-vis architecture and planning in our country. I am also extremely grateful that there is an air of consensus in this House with regard to how our students need to be given new opportunities in education and specially, how new knowledge needs to be developed.
Sir, I would beg your indulgence on one issue, which has been raised by a Member of Parliament from the State of Odisha, Shri Bhupinder Singh. He has made a suggestion here, saying why don’t we replace the hon. Visitor and have somebody else suggested, instead of the President of India, as the Head of the Institution. I humbly submit to you, Sir, that it has been my privilege and extreme honour that I serve under the guidance and leadership of Shri Pranab Mukherjee. He has taken a lot of pain in ensuring that quality education is imparted to our students. Hence, if there is any part of that suggestion which, in any way, gives this impression that we don’t appreciate his leadership or the stature of the President’s Office, I would request you, Sir, if the House accepts, to have such a suggestion expunged from the record.
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Okay; I will go through the record to see if there is anything.
SHRIMATI SMRITI ZUBIN IRANI: Sir, here, I would also out- rightly reject Shri Bhupinder Singh’s charge that the East or the North-East has been ignored.
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: He is not here.
SHRIMATI SMRITI ZUBIN IRANI: Sir, he is not here, but I would reject the charge nonetheless in his absence. I reject it because in the field of education, we have formulated, within IIT, Guwahati, a component called Ishanya Vikas, which helps us integrate children of the North-East, and specially, bright, meritorious young students, from Standard-IX onwards to our Engineering College students, and facilitate an all expenses paid-interface with all our IITs, NITs and Central Universities across the country. Hence, I dismiss that charge. But I am delighted to comment on what Shri Shantaram Naik said today. इन्होने अपने शब्दों के तिरो को मखमल मैं लपेट कर हैं और आज एक हाथ अग्री किया हैं की रही हूँ, जिसके लिए मै आभार हूँ, लेकिन लेफ्ट हैंड से थोड़ी-सी चपत भी मार दी और कहा की एस्ट्रोलोजर के पास न जाया जाए । मैं उन्हें कहना चाहती हूं की जब मेरा साइंटिफिक टेम्पर क्वेश्चन होता है, जो कनिमोजिजी ने भी क्वेश्चन कियां और जब यह बताया जाता हैं की संविधान साइंटिफिक टेम्पर करने की कही न कही हम ड्यूटी हैं,वाही संविधान हमें इस बात का अधिकार है। (… व्यवधान… )
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Concerned Member is not present
श्रीमतीस्मृतिजुबिनईरानी; सर, मैं फिर भी बोल दो, अगर आप की परमिशन हो। वाही संविधान मुझे भी इस बात की मैं अपनी रलिगिओउस् फ्रीडम को एक्स्प्लोर कर सकती हूं । मेरा आस्था का विषय कटघरे मैं नहीं आएगा । यह भी संविधान सुरक्षित करता हैं ।मैन साइंटिफिक टेम्पर, मेरे ऊपर अरूप लगता हैं चाहूंगी। … (व्याधन)…
श्रीआनंदशर्मा; नहीं, नहीं … (व्याधन)…
श्रीमतीमृतिजुबिनईरानी: आपने शायद सुना नहीं, आनंद जी शायद इसलिए , क्योंकि उन्होंने छोटी ऊँगली मे पन्ना पहना हैं … (व्याधन)… I am not yielding. Let me also say that since he emphasises that it is not a personal attack, he reminds me of my duty as the HRD Minister of this country, and that I should uphold scientific temper. Let me highlight to him, through you, that my predecessor, in fact, waited as per astrological charts for that opportune moment to actually coming to office.
SHRI ANAND SHARMA: Which one?
SHRIMATI SMRITI ZUBIN IRANI: I don’t want to name.
...(Interruptions)... He is my predecessor....(Interruptions)... You can google it....(Interruptions)... Why am I saying this today?
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Actually ...(Interruptions)... One second....(Interruptions)...
SHRIMATI SMRITI ZUBIN IRANI: Allow me....(Interruptions)... I would beg your indulgence....(Interruptions).. Allow me...(Interruptions)... यह तो मुझे निचा दिखने के लियें नहीं कहा गया, कहीं न कहीं एक उपहास का विषय था और जिसका मैं यहाँ पैर उत्तर दे रहीं हूँ । लकिन इस मे कुछ गंभीर प्रश्न जो खड़े हुए हैं, इनकी और मई आकर्षित करना चाहूंगी। … (व्यवधान ) …
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Hon. Minister, I would like to make one observation. Scientific temper doesn’t mean that one should not have religious faith. A person having religious faith can certainly have scientific temper....(Interruptions)...
THE MINISTER OF COMMUNICATIONS AND INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY (SHRI RAVI SHANKAR PRASAD): One thing more, Sir, on a serious note. Our constitutional scheme and the heritage of this country permit us to have that faith and also respect other’s faith. ...(Interruptions)...
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: I fully agree....(Interruptions)...
SHRI P. RAJEEVE: Don’t mix it with faith....(Interruptions)...
श्रीसतीशचन्द्रमिश्रा: सर, रवि शंकर जी जब इधर थे, तो वे रोज हम लोगो का हाथ देखा करते थे। …(व्याधन) …
श्रीरविशंकरप्रसाद: सर, मैं सतीश चन्द्र जी का बड़ा सम्मान करता हूँ, लेकिन आज तक मैंने सिर्फ उनकी बुद्धि देखि हैं, उनका हाथ नहीं देखा हैं। … (व्यवधान) …
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Both are advocates.
SHRI D. RAJA: Let us not mix religion and politics.
श्रीउपसभापति; राजा जी, हम प्रजा हैं और वे दोनों एडवोकेट हैं, इसलिए हम लोग नहीं समाज पाएंगेHon. Minister, please continue.
SHRIMATI SMRITI ZUBIN IRANI: Sir, it is always a delight, Sir, to see my seniors engage in such conversation; it gladdens my heart. I would also like to address certain issues here that have been put forth by Members of Parliament. I would like to compliment Prof. Jogen Chowdhury who has given his maiden speech. He was extremely concerned about the aesthetic nature of architecture in our country. I would like to assure him, Sir, that the current curriculum which is being taught in the School of Planning and Architecture also gives importance to the aesthetic values not only from an urban perspective but also from a historical perspective and rural perspective. Sir, I would like to tell him that this concept of smart cities is not a misnomer or is not a fallacy. It is a reality that we are pursuing which seeks to give us better standards of living and better facilities and I am hoping that the students who pass out the School of Planning and Architecture can actually contribute to that development.
I would also like to compliment Vijilaji for such an enthusiastic speech. Ambeth Rajanji had certain concerns about the reservation policy. I would like to say and assure the House that the reservation policy vis-a-vis admission for students will be completely followed in the Schools of Planning and Architecture, as is seen in the IITs and the NITs. The reservation policy as mandated by an Act of Parliament in the IITs and NITs vis-a-vis recruitment is the same policy and the same approach which would be followed in the Schools of Planning and Architecture as well.
Sir, Shri Ritabrata Benerjee spoke about assimilation of ideas, history, culture and also explored various facets of architecture and old civilisations. I would like to again compliment him for his speech.
C.M. Rameshji was a bit worried about whether AICTE would intervene in the autonomous functioning of SPAs. Sir, let me tell him that once it attains status of Institution of National Importance, that particular kind of blessing from this House and this Parliament, only nomenclatures will be identified by our regulators. In terms of the functioning of the School of Planning and Architecture, there shall be no intervention by the regulators.
Sir, there was a concern expressed whether our traditional Indian architecture, architecture vis-a-vis how buildings are to be constructed to help those who have special needs, is a part of curriculum also and whether restoration is part of the curriculum. Sir, I would like to highlight here that yes, restoration, buildings and planning of towns from the perspective of those citizens who have special needs is a part of the curriculum and so is studying of Indian traditional architecture and planning.
Sir, there was a question raised as to whether this Council, which is sought to be set up under the School of Planning and Architecture, will also influence other institutions. This Council is being constituted only from a governance perspective of these three Schools as being established by law.
Sir, there was a concern expressed by hon. Member, Shri Rajeev Gowda, with regards to faculty and also having an interface between industry and faculty. Sir, through you, I would like to tell him that industry experts are being invited. We have made platforms available for them to be invited into our institutions so that our students can benefit by interactions with them. We are in the process of instituting a Council for higher education and industry collaboration in which the academic perspective of industry experts will also be taken cognisance of. Similarly, Sir, we are in the process of designing a global initiative of academic networks, wherein we seek to invite industry experts from across the world so that the best international practices and new knowledge can be shared with our institutions. The financial burden of it will be borne by the Government of India.
Sir, there has been an exhaustive deliberation on whether there is a social component to these institutions and how they can help us enhance, or possibly what is the impact of such institutions on those who are possibly facing challenging times in and around these institutions. We have constituted an Unnat Bharat Abhiyan wherein our IITs, NITs and Central Universities have been told and encouraged to take in villages surrounding those institutions so that there can be technology transfer and transfer of new knowledge. I would like to tell the hon. Member, through you, Sir, that after this Bill gets the blessings of this Parliament, we will ensure that the Unnat Bharat Abhiyan campaign even includes Schools of Planning and Architecture.
Shantaramji had one concern whether municipal laws and regulations and building code is being studied. I would like to tell him that it is the practice within these Institutions. He also asked whether people who have studied out of these institutions can work with regard to our civic bodies, or for that matter, State Governments. That is also something which is under way.
Sir, there has been a little bit of question raised with regards to how can we internationalise our standards in these institutions, or possibly, whether we are exploring such things. Before I end my intervention, I would also like to highlight, through you, to this entire House that international tie-ups which already exist include the Melbourne University, the University of Amsterdam, Norwegian University, University of Leeds, University of Michigan, University of Paris and University of Hamburg. So, there had been many international tie-ups already within these institutions, and I am sure, after they are given this kind of a mandate from this very Parliament, they will explore new possibilities and new horizons internationally.
I once again, through you, Sir, would like to thank all the Members of this august House who have supported this Bill. If there is any other clarification, I will clarify.
SHRI SATISH CHANDRA MISRA: Sir, I have a small clarification. In the curriculum for architecture, are you introducing or making it compulsory that every design which is made either for the buildings or for the cities should be disabled-friendly? A disabled-friendly plan should be a compulsory thing but it is not there in most of the buildings.
SHRIMATI SMRITI ZUBIN IRANI: Sir, I have just answered thisquestion. I shall reiterate that it is a part of the curriculum. Building ofbuildings and planning of towns and villages from the disability perspective is there.
श्रीके. सी. त्यागी; सर, मैं बिल पर उस समय नहीं बोला था ।मेरि जानकारी मे आया है की बी जे पी और कांग्रेस लिए वास्तुकला मे अड्मिनिसिओं मांडटोरय और कंपल्सरी कराया है, ताकि वास्तुशास्त्र के हिसाब से ये परमानेंट सत्ता में रह सका और वे विपक्ष माँ रह सकें ।
SHRIMATI SMRITI ZUBIN IRANI: Sir, I would like to clarify that there is no confusion. Firstly, my best wishes on his birthday. Entrance in these institutions will be through the Joint Entrance Exam as is done in the IITs.
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Now, Mr. Gowda....(Interruptions)... SHRIMATI VIJILA SATHYANANTH: I need to clarify one thing. Sir, there is a need for giving protection from legal and professional liabilities....(Interruptions)... Sir, a number of foreign architects are practising in our country. How can we evolve a mutual exchange between the Indian architects and the foreign architects, and, how can we have coordination between the architecture education and the profession? How are we going to do this?
PROF. M. V. RAJEEV GOWDA: Sir, the Minister has emphasized on the industry linkages but faculty is prevented from actually going out for enhancing their practice. That needs to be changed.
SHRIMATI SMRITI ZUBIN IRANI: Sir, the Members of this House will agree that faculty has been brought into institution to teach, and, since many Members have expressed concerns that there are gaps in faculty recruitment, we would rather retain most of our faculty to teach our students. As I said, if there is a faculty member, who seeks to indulge in research, we are definitely supporting that kind of research. We have done that through the IITs and the NITs, and, I am sure that we will do the same even in the Schools of Planning and Architecture.
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Thank you.
The question is:
That the Bill to establish and declare Schools of Planning and Architecture as institutions of national importance in order to promote education and research in architectural studies including planning of human settlements, as passed by Lok Sabha, be taken into consideration.
The motion was adopted.
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: We shall now take up clause-by-clause consideration of the Bill.
Clauses 2 and 3 were added to the Bill.
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: In clause 4, there is one Amendment No. (1) by Dr. Kanwar Deep Singh. Are you moving the amendment?
DR. KANWAR DEEP SINGH: Sir, please allow me to mention the reasons for moving my amendment. Sir, housing, malls and other business buildings are booming in the country, and, as such, good planners and architects are required. At present, only three Schools of Planning and Architecture are there in a vast country like ours. The school at New Delhi caters to the students of north India, the school at Bhopal caters to the students of Central India, and, the school at Vijayawada caters to the students of South India. There is no school in Eastern and Western India.
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: So, this is your amendment.
DR. KANWAR DEEP SINGH: Through this amendment, I want to have a School of Planning and Architecture in Kolkata because it is an important central place in Eastern India.
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: All right.
DR. KANWAR DEEP SINGH: Sir, give me one minute. Sir, it is a gateway to north-eastern States. If a school is set up here, the students of West Bengal, other eastern States and north-east will be benefited a lot. Hence, the school is absolutely necessary in Kolkata. I, therefore, urge upon the hon. Minister to accept my amendment or give an assurance to set up a school. If she gives me the assurance, then, I will reconsider.
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Hon. Minister, will you accept the amendment or will you give an assurance?
SHRIMATI SMRITI ZUBIN IRANI: Sir, clause 32(2)(b) actually provides for the Council of School of Planning and Architecture to recommend to the Central Government, as and when the need arises, for establishment of Schools of Planning and Architecture. Under this autonomous function of the Council, I am sure, when the Council proposes the same, I shall happily accept the same.
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: Okay. There is a provision for that. So, now, you are not pressing. In the Act itself, there is a provision that the Council can recommend it, and, the Minister is ready to accept the same at that point of time.
DR. KANWAR DEEP SINGH: Sir, I am happy with the Minister’s assurance and answer, and, therefore, I am not moving my amendment.
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: So, amendment is not moved.
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: I shall now put clause 4 to vote.
Clause 4 was added to the Bill.
Clauses 5 to 42 were added to the Bill. The Schedule was added to the Bill.
Clause 1, the Enacting Formula and the Title were added to the Bill.
SHRIMATI SMRITI ZUBIN IRANI: Sir, I move: That the Bill be passed.
The question was put and the motion was adopted.
MR. DEPUTY CHAIRMAN: So, how many Bills in this Session have you got passed?
SHRIMATI SMRITI ZUBIN IRANI: Sir, three Bills. I had the fortune of having three Bills passed. ..(Interruptions)..